Posted: Sat May 07, 2005 1:46 am Post subject: also about headroom ....
I'm listening to the 19 Jan DVD right now and have suddenly realised what keeps me coming back to it almost everyday: that curious feeling that although the music as it is is already superb, these guys are surely capable of much, much more.
I feel that also applies to some extent to Steve Morse and Scott Henderson, which might be the reason I like them so much.
On the other hand, Greg Howe doesn't have that, but I like him just as much
What do you guys think? Is it just an illusion or lack of musical/ technical experience
Joined: 10 Sep 2004 Posts: 2783 Location: Chino, CA
Posted: Sat May 07, 2005 2:21 am Post subject:
I know what you're saying, but when you say that Greg Howe doesn't seem to have that, what do you mean?
I think part of it is an "illusion" because Guthrie and the guys make it look so easy when it really isn't. A lot of advanced players who see Guthrie are amazed that he can process so many thing so quickly and do it spontaneously. A typcial comment I hear is: "I don't know how he could think so fast."
Guthrie isn't just going to play stuff that's easy for him to do. He pushes himself. That infamous tapping lick on WST isn't exactly easy for Guthrie either. But I do agree that there is so much more that Guthrie could do that we haven't seen him do yet. I've already seen Guthrie do a lot of stuff that aren't on the DVDs and I'm sure others here have as well.
That's really the exciting thing about Guthrie as I've mentioned so many times. We've only seen less than half of all the things he's capable of doing and he is improving all the time. And he will also continue to evolve and improve as a writer as well. The future is virtually unlimited. _________________ Ed Yoon
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Ed, it's midnight overthere in the US, what are you doing this late
Seriously, when I listen to Greg Howe it feels like he's always pushing to the limit, technically and musically - which is not a bad thing at all, like I said he's my favourite player. On the other hand the Fellowship guys "seem" more relaxed.
Maybe it's because it's live on the DVD, and they do lots of jamming on it.
On a different note there's a clear "British flavour" in their playing, it's hard for me to explain, but think more Led Zeppo, not BB King or Dylan
Joined: 10 Sep 2004 Posts: 2783 Location: Chino, CA
Posted: Sat May 07, 2005 4:02 am Post subject:
Uhhh, actually, it's a little after 9PM now here in California.
Hmmm... Perhaps it's just perception, but I also feel that Greg has that "headroom" kind of thing in his playing although I can't really imagine what he does being played faster or technically more difficult.
The Fellowship is a loose jam band although there are some intricate ensemble and unison parts that need superb timing and execution by the musicians.
I also agree that it is indeed very British-sounding (whatever that may be) compared to American-based shred and fusion players. _________________ Ed Yoon
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Joined: 12 Mar 2005 Posts: 214 Location: Hong Kong
Posted: Sat May 07, 2005 4:20 am Post subject:
Yes! Another British Invasion!!!
I think that's the great thing about different cultures (yes, the Brits are different to the Yanks (can I say "Yank"? - no offence intended ) and how they can take something, make it there own, and then mix it back in...
The evolution of Guitar!!! _________________ "My day job feeds my family, my night gig feeds my ego!"
I think that's the great thing about different cultures (yes, the Brits are different to the Yanks (can I say "Yank"? - no offence intended ) and how they can take something, make it there own, and then mix it back in...
The evolution of Guitar!!!
yeah, the guys in the GT gang can all sure play!
guthrie, jamie, shaun baxter, dave kilminster, hilborne, eric roach... that's a serious lineup there!
Guthers also uses a very british sound (thanks in part to a VERY british amp), although guitars like fenders, gibsons, and indeed Suhrs are american guitars they always feel (to me) to have a more English feel and sound than something like a Jackson, Ibanez (japanese, yes, strange), or Musicman.
Joined: 10 Sep 2004 Posts: 2783 Location: Chino, CA
Posted: Tue May 10, 2005 5:03 am Post subject:
art wrote:
Guthers also uses a very british sound (thanks in part to a VERY british amp), although guitars like fenders, gibsons, and indeed Suhrs are american guitars they always feel (to me) to have a more English feel and sound than something like a Jackson, Ibanez (japanese, yes, strange), or Musicman.
Soundwise for sure, but even the phrasing of Brits tend to be somewhat different and I can't put my hand on it. There's a bit more of some indescribable "refinement" in the playing of the Brits compared to the Americans. It's not to say that British players are more technical or anything liket that, but over the years, when you compare the US and UK counterparts, you can't deny that there are distinctive characteristics between the two. _________________ Ed Yoon
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Dave K was depping for Guthrie the other day at the bassment. He did a pretty good job. I don't know how long it's going on for.. but there is scope for the band to gel more.. then again Guthrie and Zak, Seth and Pete have been playing for years. He did a top job, any idea how long he'll be there for? So I can drop in and check it out again see if it gets more fluid between Zack and Dave.. _________________ Fabulous powers were revealed to me the day I held my magic Suhr(d) aloft and said "by the power of great scale!"
I think that's the great thing about different cultures (yes, the Brits are different to the Yanks (can I say "Yank"? - no offence intended ) and how they can take something, make it there own, and then mix it back in...
The evolution of Guitar!!!
yeah, the guys in the GT gang can all sure play!
guthrie, jamie, shaun baxter, dave kilminster, hilborne, eric roach... that's a serious lineup there!
bring the invasion on!
Not to mention other British players, like Martin Taylor, Pete Callard and, errrr....Neil Brocklebank?!
Joined: 10 Sep 2004 Posts: 2783 Location: Chino, CA
Posted: Thu May 12, 2005 9:23 pm Post subject:
I've started working out at the gym and have been watching various people running on the treadmill. And we've all seen all kinds of people jog or run at the park. The good runners are fast while making it look effortless. They are faster when jogging in a leisurely manner than most people are in their full sprint with their teeths clenched. That's the sense I get when I watch Guthrie play. _________________ Ed Yoon
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i'm a big football fan and if we were to compare great guitar players to nfl running backs or wide receivers, guthrie would be like a complete player who has speed, power, vision, great hands for receiving, open field running ability, shiftiness, jumping ability, ability to break tackles, etc. he may not be the fastest, but fastest players don't necessarily make good players either. track stars often fail to make it as nfl players.
guthrie reminds me of great nfl running backs in their prime: eric dickerson's grace and speed, marshall faulk's all-around versatility, the heart and athleticism of walter payton... receivers-wise, jerry rice in his prime with the 49ers and the smooth explosiveness of marvin harrison... what all of these guys have in common is how easy they make it all look. guthrie sure makes it look easy and effortless.
Joined: 08 Feb 2005 Posts: 80 Location: Uppsala Sweden
Posted: Fri May 20, 2005 5:42 pm Post subject:
I remember reading an interview with Marty Friedman where he said thatone of the things
he liked most about Uli Jon Roth was the feeling that he always had more to give.
That was for some reason something that stuck and even though I didn't quite get
it at first I started to listen for that and appreciate it.
It is, as you point out, not something every guitarist have to have.
Some u like because they give it all they got(perception wise).
But it's a quality I like in a guitar player.
I disagree with you on the Greg Howe item though. _________________ Jesus saves, but Gretzky scores on the rebound
Joined: 10 Sep 2004 Posts: 2783 Location: Chino, CA
Posted: Fri May 20, 2005 7:53 pm Post subject:
shredrulez wrote:
i'm a big football fan and if we were to compare great guitar players to nfl running backs or wide receivers, guthrie would be like a complete player who has speed, power, vision, great hands for receiving, open field running ability, shiftiness, jumping ability, ability to break tackles, etc. he may not be the fastest, but fastest players don't necessarily make good players either. track stars often fail to make it as nfl players.
guthrie reminds me of great nfl running backs in their prime: eric dickerson's grace and speed, marshall faulk's all-around versatility, the heart and athleticism of walter payton... receivers-wise, jerry rice in his prime with the 49ers and the smooth explosiveness of marvin harrison... what all of these guys have in common is how easy they make it all look. guthrie sure makes it look easy and effortless.
Those are some interesting analogies, shred. My guess is that over half of the forum members probably don't have the slightest idea who those players are but you make a good point. Fastest runners don't make good running backs nor wide receivers. Strongest players don't make good baseball hitters. The ones who jump the highest don't make the best basketball players. The ability to do all those things well certainly helps.
When you look at great athletes, sure they have immense physical talent, but once again, it's one does with 'em - knowing how to put the talent to use. Ultimately, a lot of it is so mental as well in sports. And the heart - the will, the determination, the drive, the patience, the confidence, etc. to win and succeed. I think that's what made Michael Jordan so great - his mind and his heart actually shone greater than his physical talents alone. Let's hope that Guthrie can rise to the occasion as well. _________________ Ed Yoon
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Joined: 12 Mar 2005 Posts: 214 Location: Hong Kong
Posted: Sat May 21, 2005 8:07 am Post subject:
My preference is not to compare music with sports...
BTW Delicato, I *just* missed an opportunity to see a Marty Friedman clinic here in Hong Kong this week! Damn! Worse still, it was only HKD 40.00 (that's about US 5.00)... I'm not a fan of that Megadeth stuff, but it would have been good to go along and see what his playing is like. I'm interested in Asian scales and sounds and I know that Marty is right into it (he can speak Japanese as well).
Now, Uli Jon Roth - that is one awesome player (Yngwie, go and eat your heart out)! _________________ "My day job feeds my family, my night gig feeds my ego!"
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