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Guitarists Guthrie REALLY Likes A Lot
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alexkhan



Joined: 10 Sep 2004
Posts: 2783
Location: Chino, CA

PostPosted: Sat Feb 19, 2005 12:30 am    Post subject: Guitarists Guthrie REALLY Likes A Lot Reply with quote

Guthrie obviously digs many, many guitar players and have about absorbed them all - from Wes to Jimi to JB to McLaughlin to EVH to Vai. Having hung out with him during all of NAMM week and spending many hours talking about all kinds of stuff and guitar players (and also corresponding on a regular basis), there were certain names that just popped up very often or whose names would make Guthrie take notice and express great reverence. I'll sort of separate them by genres since Guthrie's tastes range so wide:

FUSION

Scott Henderson
Greg Howe
John McLaughlin
Allan Holdsworth
Shawn Lane
Wayne Krantz

ROCK

Jimi Hendrix
Jeff Beck
Eric Johnson - mucho respect for EJ!
Eric Clapton

MODERN SHRED/ROCK/FUSION

Bumblefoot
Mattias IA Eklundh
Richie Kotzen
Dave Kilminster
Joel Hoekstra - said that the "TMIF" album has really grown on him.

JAZZ

Didn't get to really touch on the subject of jazz players too much, but I know for a fact that Guthrie really enjoys and respects the following and I'm sure there are more.

Wes Montgomery
Pat Metheny
John Scofield

COUNTRY

Guthrie has mentioned these two on more than a few occasions.

Scotty Anderson
Brent Mason

SLIDE

Sonny Landreth
Derek Trucks

ACOUSTIC

Paco DeLucia - mucho, mucho respect for Paco!
Eric Roche
Thomas Leeb - enjoyed his opening sets quite a bit.
Tuck Andress

I'm sure there are many more, but just based on hanging out with him, these are the names that got mentioned a lot and that Guthrie expressed a lot of reverence for.
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zea



Joined: 10 Dec 2004
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 19, 2005 1:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

great infos , ! Thanks Ed.

I'm sure that he likes Standley Jordan too. Very Happy
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James W



Joined: 22 Oct 2004
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 19, 2005 2:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Does Guthrie like Jason Becker?




Also, having just recently come across the man, I can safely say Paco De Lucia is one of the most sublime players; acoustic or electric.


Does anyone else think that Guitar Techniques should transcribe a Jason Becker song?



... Love James XXX
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AL



Joined: 17 Jan 2005
Posts: 10

PostPosted: Sat Feb 19, 2005 2:44 pm    Post subject: Jason Becker !!! Reply with quote

Jason is without doubt one of the greatest guitarist/composers this planet will ever see Exclamation He could play things at 17 that very few accomplished players could ever play and he has an amazing style all of his own.Just check out his new hot licks video to see what he can do.Its the most inspiring guitar playing i have ever seen.AMAZING technique and amazing phrasing.Its a crime that the guitar mags dont transcribe some of his music and talk of him more.Whenever a guitarist lists all their favourite players and jason is not among them its always apparent that they have never listened to much of jasons music.He is the most amazing player AND amazing song writer! Hes probably too good and out on his own that other players just cant grasp what he's about and overlook him. Visit his website and be prepared to change your view on guitar playing forever!
www.jasonbecker.com
And aside form being one of the greatest guitarists ever he has one of the most inspiring yet sad life stories you will ever read about!
Check out his Perpetual Burn / Perspective albums! Must have's for guitar fans! Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked Exclamation
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alexkhan



Joined: 10 Sep 2004
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 19, 2005 11:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jason Becker has never come up in my conversations with Guthrie. I don't think he's very enamored with the neoclassical style of playing and sound although I'm sure he went through the phase of learning a lot of the stuff by Yngwie, MacAlpine, V Moore, etc. during his formative years (early-teens). I'm sure Guthrie is well aware of Jason Becker and he may even be a big fan, but I haven't heard Guthrie mention anything yet.

Personally, I also dislike the neoclassical sort of sound and style. I still feel that Yngwie sort of hit the high mark in that style with the Rising Force album of '84 and there were some interesting variations on the theme by MacAlpine on Edge of Insanity and Maximum Security and V Moore on Mind's Eye and Time Odyssey, but by then, it seemed the genre had already become stale. I remember getting the vinyl LPs by Joey Tafolla, Cacophony, Chastain, Michael Fath, and so many others around that time and I burnt out on it really fast and I've come to really dislike that whole style of playing.

As of now, I think Symphony X does a better job of it than most others still clinging onto what has become an underground genre for the diehard fanatics, but there's just something about traditional classical music themes and concepts and rock music that don't seem to mix very well. I like SyX because of their writing and ensemble musicianship although I find their whole sound can get rather bombastic and overbearing. Also, almost every player playing in this style of music has a really bad tone - thin, buzzy, too compressed, too gainy... Another thing I don't enjoy listening to is swept arpeggios up and down the neck over and over again. I dunno... I start hearing that kind of stuff and I just lose interest right away.

I can appreciate that Becker was a monster talent and could have evolved into something truly great, but I think his timing was really bad. He came around after Yngwie had firmly established himself as the de facto standard in that genre and you really can't say that what Becker did eclipses the best of what Yngwie or even what MacAlpine accomplished in the mid-80's. Becker does really stand out in terms of talent - no doubt about it, but personally, it's just not the style I could get into.
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Javi



Joined: 16 Nov 2004
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 20, 2005 12:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Ed,
I have to say that I respect your musical taste deeply. In fact, I think your preferences in music probably are very similar to my preferences, but I dislike on something: Jason didn't play just Neoclasical! Jason played "classical", which is more musically vast than the mere subgenere neoclassical . I don't know if you noticed but there's a quite huge difference between the Malmsteen playing and Becker's playing, even in styles. Although their style could come from the same root, Becker's playing, for example was much more ellaborated and more brainy and didn't stop in just playing arpegios. If you check "Perpetual Burn", I guarantee you that you will find more resources coming from the Rock and Heavy than just the typical Neoclassical scales and modes that Malmsteen or Joe Stump use to bombard us. And considering that he only could record a couple of Solo records, apart of other records with Cacophony, You could noticed that this guy wasn't going to stop doing the same thing again and again like Malmsteen or Stump did. He was evoluting or developing all the time. But he couldn't play the guitar anymore. In fact, his taste goes more for shred and rock-heavy-fusion (Is this a style? Shocked ) than this subgenere. Sorry Ed, we can't compare Jason with Malmsteen or even with MacAlpine or Vinnie Moore. Yes, probably, they had their moments of neoclassical vain for a time, but they evolutionated and each one got his own way. So, Is MacAlpine playing like Malmsteen now? I don't think so. Yes, I know in one time they played that kind of n-classical stuff but It is not the same MacAlpine playing one of his early "neoclassical" tunes than Malmsteen doing one of his. One evolutioned and the other one just got stuck with a lack of new musical ideas, rejecting the change and playing under the same subgenere again and again, which it is redundant and tiring. On the other hand, I agree with you that Neoclassical style is a very narrow resource for expressing yourself on the guitar or with any other instrument; to be very clear, although is very exagerated, it is like to listen all the time "La Bamba" in different keys and different tempos... Evil or Very Mad Well, it is not just like that, but it is an idea how I feel about neoclassical. So, It is obvious that Jason Becker didn't have the time and the health for developing himself like a guitarist, so we shouldn't put this awesome man with the Malmsteen gang. They are just "a couple" anyway. But I understand aswell that maybe it is just a question of taste which I share with you. I have to say aswell I don't dislike Malmsteen but his music become tiring and boring to listen at times. And these guitarists, like Stump aswell, deserve a certain credit. Anyway, my taste goes more for Jazz and Fusion than any other style. So, Neoclassical is not my field. And Jason, definitively wasn't in that field.
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alexkhan



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PostPosted: Sun Feb 20, 2005 2:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Javi,

I understand what you're saying. I didn't really mean to say that Jason Becker was just another neoclassical shredder but that, by circumstances of the timing of his burst onto the scene, he got lumped into that group that came after Yngwie, MacAlpine, and V Moore, and really was never able to distance himself from that crowd before he came down with that awful ALS disease. It's more of a public perception thing and I must admit that I'm part of that public.

He arrived on the scene when players playing hyper-speed runs and arpeggios were virtually indistinguishable from one another. There was such a massive barrage of players who were supposed to be the new "fastest", "greatest", etc. Shrapnel and Co. kept marketing new players in that manner and they made it seem like, "If you don't get this new guy's record, you're missing out on the best!" Rolling Eyes Well, after falling for that line about a dozen times, I've just about had enough. And this was after the Cacophony's Speed Metal Symphony album. By the time of Perpetual Burn, I wasn't interested in anything from that genre and Shrapnel. My mindset by then was: "I'm not falling for it anymore. I'll stick with Satch and Vai." Now, even the word "Shrapnel" makes me cringe. Mad

It's an unfortunate thing. Jason's career is about as tragic as it can be although I'm sure he's doing the best he can with great courage under such unfortunate circumstances. But those early records before he came down with that disease simply didn't bode well for his legacy. His technique and musicianship is really as amazing as that of any other player I've heard and he may have indeed have evolved and progressed to the outer limits of someone like Holdsworth and Lane. I'm listening to the clips from the Perpetual Burn album now and the playing is great, but it's just not the kind of music and style of playing I enjoy listening to. Well, people have told me the same thing about Guthrie's playing and music... I'd say one out of every 20 people I introduce Guthrie's music to will share the same enthusiasm as you and I... You know how it goes...
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AL



Joined: 17 Jan 2005
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 20, 2005 8:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In reply to Alexkhan.. Alex,i agree with you and i dont.If you know of some of jasons later recordings he was breaking away from the whole shred thing.Even the album he played on with David Lee Roth(a lil'aint enough) is a great example.That was some of the most awesome blues/country/rock and general tasty licks you could ever hear Cool
Jason had a lot more than just monster technique.He was a composer.Listen to the Perspective album.Even watch his hot licks video, he could play some mean jazz style and country and classical licks Shocked I just wanted to point that out as i thought you gave jason an unfair description Crying or Very sad
Jason was a lot more than just his god like technique.When jason played
his guitar you could feel what he was playing.FEEL!!!
If he was still playing today i dont think anyone would be in Jasons league and in general i dont like to compare guitarists but he would have been soooooooooo good it just wouldnt have been funny.He was a genius songwriter and composer too.How many virtuoso standard players have great songwriting skills?
Very very few!!
Most of em spent so much time concentrating on their technique they
overlooked the important part.Songwriting! And besides i think technique ANYONE can attain but songwriting n composition is something that has to be on the inside.Surely technique and knowledge can help bring it out but the skill of songwriting is something thats already in all of us and some people have more skill for it than others irrespective of technique
standard.Look at people like noel gallagher.I know he sucks and i hate oasis music but those songs are very well written.He has xxxx all musical technique but he could write some catchy tunes.I have bought so many guitar albums where the guitarists can play some of the
craziest and most skillful guitar passages imaginable but damn its hard to listen to as the general songs sucked and lacked any structure or melodies.
I know im puttin myself in for a barrage of retaliation for all this but its true.
Anyway,i veered off course there... All that aside alex i respect what your doing for guthrie with this forum,so keep up the great work.Guthrie deserves so much more credit from the guitar world than he is getting..
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alexkhan



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PostPosted: Sun Feb 20, 2005 11:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, I didn't mean this thread to turn into a debate about Jason Becker's place in the history of the electric guitar, but we may as well delve into it if that's where it's going. I'm going to copy and paste from another thread I posted about this matter on another forum and it's going to be quite lengthy. It's interesting to observe the devotion of the Jason Becker fans that has been kept alive since the 80's. It's a very small but very vocal group of fans who keep the flame going.

I'm sorry, but I've spent much time listening to the stuff from Perpetual Burn and Perspective and there is really nothing there that makes me want to buy the albums and dig any further. It's not that I don't appreciate his significant talents as both a player and a writer. It just doesn't connect with me at all. But I can say the same about a lo of other great players and composers of the past and the present. It's more of a personal taste issue, I presume, as I have utmost respect for that kind of a talent, but it's not something that really moves me in any way.

Sombody told me, "People like to think a lot of the dead guys or guys whose careers are done could have been the 'greatest ever' because they want to believe the world was somehow cheated." It's interesting to ponder what might have been, but I've never been the type to dwell on such things. What might have Jimi done if he hadn't died at such a young age? What would Bruce Lee have done had he kept going? How many more incredible symphonies and operas may Mozart have composed if he had lived another 20~30 years like most great composers? How many Oscars would James Dean have won? How would Marilyn Monroe have aged? Obviously, we'll never know and it defies any imagination. The way I see it, it was just meant to be. They exploded like a bright supernova and disappeared just as quickly, essentially having done their work and moving onto the next plane as the guiding hands of fate intended. Those kinds of talent are very rare.

As for Becker, I really don't know what kind of influence he has left us. He was definitely a virtuoso, but the body of works he has left doesn't seem to warrant a legendary status with the likes of someone like Lane. And I've heard many mixed things from people who have seen Becker live in his Cacophony heydays: some think he's one of the greatest ever and then other guys whose judgments I trust tell me that he was nothing special. I remember listening to those Cacophony albums back in the late-80's and I was your typical guitar music fan back in those days. It was like, "Okay, that's enough. I can't take anymore of this stuff." I used to be one of those guys who'd snatch up the latest and the greatest from the Shrapnel stable and I OD'd hard. After that, it was about finding fine wine. Laughing

As for Guthrie, he won't appeal to all, just like anybody else. Some people never got into Jimi and some never got into EVH and some never can get into Jeff Beck or whoever. I admired EVH a lot and do not dare underestimate his impact on rock guitar playing, but I can't say that I was personally a big fan. I never could get into the band's music. Jimi I love dearly, but more as a musician, songwriter, and a true icon of the golden age of rock than a guitar virtuoso. Jeff Beck, to me, is still the greatest electric guitar player alive, but many would also dispute that. I prefer listening to Metheny over most fusion players, but it comes down to personal taste at this level of musicianship and virtuosity.

To me, Guthrie is still a baby just learning to walk in terms of career and artistic development. He's breaking out late, but perhaps that's just what he needed to be more well-rounded, develop the musicality, maturity and finally break out when the time is right (which seems about now, i.e., this year). I know that everyone I introduce Guthrie to don't get what he's about or that his particular style don't suit their taste. That's totally understandable. For instance, I could never get into Steve Morse even though he's just an amazing sensational player. I tried hard to get into him, but I just couldn't. Same goes for many others.

Guthrie had his opportunity when he was 18 or 19 as well - some 13~14 years ago. Mike Varney heard Guthrie's demo tapes back then and wanted to fly him out from UK to record a typical shred album and get him started out here like he did with Yngwie and so many others. That country track, "Rhode Island Shred" was written and originally recorded when Guthrie was 18. He cringes at listening to that old recording although it's about as fast as anything he's doing now. But instead of taking up on Varney's offer, Guthrie says he "chickened out" and decided that it'd be better for him to stay in UK and keep honing his skills instead of following the shred route. That "chickening out" may have been the greatest break that Guthrie had. Guthrie may have ended up with the pile of likes of Michael Chastain, Michael Fath, Mike Angelo/Batio, Joe Stump, Darren Householder, Joey Tafolla, and so many other "where are they now" names in the world of shred guitar. If Guthrie had come over to the States then to record something right around the time of "Passion & Warfare", his record have been lost and he may very well have disappeared.

So, in retrospect, I think it's a really good thing that he stayed in UK and honed his craft, develop musical maturity, teach, gig with whoever he can over there, and become a lot more than just a monstrous chopsmeister. Guys like these reach their top speed by their mid-teens. Yngwie, Vai, Lane and the likes have all said that they maxed out on their speed by the time they were 16. I'm sure Guthrie was already at this current speed by around the same time. Classical kid prodigies also reach their maximum physical potential well before they are 20. After that, it's all about becoming more musically sophisticated, developing taste, feel, maturity, tone, style, phrasing, etc. I think that's what Guthrie's been developing over the past 15+ years. His chops was already there by 16 or 17, just like Lane, Yngwie, Vai, and Becker, etc. With chops like these, you either have it or don't and you know at a very early age. Consider that Guthrie started playing at the age of 3 and had already been on national British TV by the time he was 9.

But what makes Guthrie special in my mind is that he's now appealing to more than just guitar players and musicians. During the 4 shows he played here in January, nearly half were non-players - just casual fans, some who had never heard of Guthrie until the day they saw him play. There were many women at the shows. A lot of Guthrie fans, including myself, brought over their wives, girlfriends, sisters, and even mothers, etc. And they were just as mesmerized and entertained as the guitar freaks and fanatics. My wife, who'd almost never sit around and watch guitar videos with me at home (except for Metheny who she's also a big fan of), actually has asked me on two occasions to see the Jan 19 show DVD with me. She says, "Hey, can we watch that Guthrie DVD Sunday night after we put the kids to sleep?" I'm like,Shocked . And she'll watch that whole thing from start to finish, genuinely enjoying the music, not so much the guitar nerd stuff that we're looking at. The pastor at the church called to say how much he and his wife enjoyed the Gutrhie show on Jan 18. My wife's friend who has masters in piano performance called and said that a Guthrie show she attended with her husband was one of the most incredible and also enjoyable concerts she had ever seen.

So, I think that's a very positive aspect of what Guthrie offers and why he does indeed differ from so many other similarly gifted monster players. He can hold people's interest, even that of non-players and non-musicians. That was probably the most positive thing I got out of Guthrie's shows and the feedback I've received. And people are buying multiple copies of the DVD to give out to friends and family members, etc. It's a very cool thing to observe.

But getting back to Jason Becker, he may indeed have turned out to be amazing. We'll never know. Lane's place in history is fairly secure, even if just out in the fringes of the mainstream. He's a bonafide legend. Howe is another somewhat enigmatic figure and his reputation is almost unparalleled, but his stature through the body of his works is kind of questionable at this point in time. Holdsworth has been a legend since the 70's, so we don't even need to talk about him. Guthrie, as I said, is just starting out although he's been around a while. He has the next 20~30 years ahead of him (quite possibly more) to leave a substantial body of works and perform as he is now, assuming he doesn't encounter any unusual circumstances. Guthrie, to me, represents the cutting edge in the future of the electric guitar. His potential is virtually limitless and that's what I find so exciting about him. There's just no telling where he could take the music and the playing. He'll never be the "best" as there is no such thing. I just don't believe in that kind of talk. It's just about taking that talent of his as far as it will go. I know that's all I care about.
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Javi



Joined: 16 Nov 2004
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 21, 2005 12:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey Ed,
My wife wouldn't sit down with me to watch a Guitar concert DVD either Confused , but she loves Pat Metheny too Very Happy . And aswell she went to the Bassment Concerts several times without pressing on her Laughing Yes, Ed, Guthrie's got something special Wink
And thank you very much for what you are doing for him... and for us.
Bless you! Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy
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AL



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PostPosted: Mon Feb 21, 2005 9:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In reply to alexkhan,
A lot of what you say is true 100 % and i agree with you mostly.
You are an intelligent sounding guy Wink
Music is personal taste and opinion without doubt.The whole function of music is to bring out different types of emotion in people.And everyone has different emotions and therefore different musical tastes and needs.I went to see Jeff beck in concert 2 years ago mainly because i was such a massive becker fan and i had heard him talking about jeff as a major influence.I wasnt expecting much to be honest as i was only aware of his
recordings with rod stewart that my mother had bombarded me with since
i was a kid so i wasnt a fan that stage,
but once Jeff walked out and started to play i was floored Shocked
He was playing things on the guitar that just didnt seem possible.Not in ways of sheer technical speed but the way he got certain sounds and emotions from his guitar.I spent the whole concert just laughing as i watched him.I was watching but couldnt figure out half the sounds he was making.He truly spoke with his guitar.Even the awesome jennifer batten beside him seemed to be laughing at jeff's mastery.The crowd at first where a little stoked as there was no vocals in jeff's set.He was supporting sting so there probably wasnt too many people there that knew of jeff's music.But by the end of the concert you could hear a pin drop.He just poured pure emotion from his guitar.And his setup was very very basic.A simple strat straight into a marshall amp,with no effects what so ever and very little gain.I could talk forever on how much that concert affected me.i agree with you alex as i think after watching jeff play and since then buying ALL of his albums that he is probably the greatest player in the world in terms of expressing himself through his guitar.Mindblowing!! I still disagree with you about becker though Wink
Anyhoo,keep up the great work and if your ever chatting with guthrie again tell him to hurry the fxxk up with his album Crying or Very sad
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James W



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PostPosted: Mon Feb 21, 2005 1:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"With chops like these, you either have it or don't and you know at a very early age."



Crying or Very sad This seems quite a depressing notion which basically means there's not much point in working technique because; 'you either have it or you don't'. All those guys worked extremely hard on their technique. A lot of it is hard work. Also (about the early age thing) Holdsworth started at 17; therefore there is still chance for late comers, if they are willing to work for it. All famous classical instrumentalists would work extremely hard; I feel you are going to put off a great many guitarists with having that attitude.



By the way, I apologise for apparently starting a digression about Jason Becker. My opinion is, of course, that he is a trully wonderful guitarists; one of my most favourite ever and the reason I work so hard on the guitar; even if I do not feel like it. I feel that it is redundant saying he is just another token, post-Yngwie, neo-classical player; as he is far more protean than that. I play the classical guitar, as well as the electric, and am studying music at A-level and can tell you now that Yngwie is far more the plagiarist of Bach, Mozart etc. than Jason is. Yngwie's playing may have been quite a revelation at the time, but his MUSIC was a cheap, and rather mediocre rip-off of classical pieces. Jason's music is not. Jason's music is far more diverse and fresh. Sure, if you just listen to his playing in the early days he might sound a bit classically-cliched but he soon grew out of that to produce such a masterpiece as Perspective. Also watch his magnificent video and purchase Both Rasberry and Blackberry Jam CDs; there is far more going on in this wonderful musician's mind than I feel he is been credited for.

I guess it is all down to opinion; I can respect you for at least appreciating Jason, even if you do not like his music that much.


It would be great if Guthrie were to actually come on here and tell us what he thought.



... Love James XXX
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Javi



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PostPosted: Mon Feb 21, 2005 3:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's why we are here. To discuss anything in relation with the music and Guthrie Govan when there's a chance Mad . It is a discussion and we must respect the fact there's different opinions, ideas thoughts, tastes, moods, etc... always with respect to everybody.
Some people like ones and others like other ones. That's normal. We are not in this site because we share everything in the same way. The only thing that tie us together in this fantastic site is the pasion for guitar music and the pasion for Guthrie's playing, and this is all thanks to Ed Idea . All the rest is for discuss when there's two or more different opinions and it doesn't have to be contradictory or opposite. Life would be boring if everybody were the same and had the same taste and opinions. I understand Ed's point of view and it is quite interesting. I've got tired of neoclassical and I have to confess I hardly ever put an Yngwie or Stump Album on my CD player since years. It doesn't appeal to me anymore. And I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT JASON'S MUSIC. But we mustn't forget that Jason only released two solo "proper" albums. So, we have been listening the same albums for nearly 20 years. So obviously, they are too many years just for two albums. So at the end of the day you could end up fed up of the same music. We know we have the jams and the clinic videos and the rest, but These two albums are the Jason's banner. And it is with these albums he identifies. So, Let's say it is a poor legacy he left us for enjoy Crying or Very sad . IN THAT TIME, nobody played like Jason. IN THAT TIME, technically, he was superior to all the rest; and I'm talking in shred terms. Because we know he wasn't a jazz player although he could play jazz perfectly if he wanted.
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alexkhan



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PostPosted: Fri Feb 25, 2005 4:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

James W wrote:
"With chops like these, you either have it or don't and you know at a very early age."



Crying or Very sad This seems quite a depressing notion which basically means there's not much point in working technique because; 'you either have it or you don't'. All those guys worked extremely hard on their technique. A lot of it is hard work. Also (about the early age thing) Holdsworth started at 17; therefore there is still chance for late comers, if they are willing to work for it. All famous classical instrumentalists would work extremely hard; I feel you are going to put off a great many guitarists with having that attitude.



By the way, I apologise for apparently starting a digression about Jason Becker. My opinion is, of course, that he is a trully wonderful guitarists; one of my most favourite ever and the reason I work so hard on the guitar; even if I do not feel like it. I feel that it is redundant saying he is just another token, post-Yngwie, neo-classical player; as he is far more protean than that. I play the classical guitar, as well as the electric, and am studying music at A-level and can tell you now that Yngwie is far more the plagiarist of Bach, Mozart etc. than Jason is. Yngwie's playing may have been quite a revelation at the time, but his MUSIC was a cheap, and rather mediocre rip-off of classical pieces. Jason's music is not. Jason's music is far more diverse and fresh. Sure, if you just listen to his playing in the early days he might sound a bit classically-cliched but he soon grew out of that to produce such a masterpiece as Perspective. Also watch his magnificent video and purchase Both Rasberry and Blackberry Jam CDs; there is far more going on in this wonderful musician's mind than I feel he is been credited for.

I guess it is all down to opinion; I can respect you for at least appreciating Jason, even if you do not like his music that much.


It would be great if Guthrie were to actually come on here and tell us what he thought.



... Love James XXX


There's no doubt that they worked at it very hard and there are always exceptions (besides Holdsworth, Tal Farlow started at 21, I believe), but virtuosos are definitely born. Great athletes don't become great without training their butts off either. But not everyone is going to become a Michael Jordan or a Tiger Woods or an Olympic gold medalist or run the 100m dash under 10 seconds just by working at it. I'm certainly not trying to discourage other players, but the kind of chops that Shawn Lane and Jason Becker had, that Guthrie, Paco, Bireli, McLaughlin, etc., has is really something one either has or don't. And if one doesn't have it, and there are plenty of great guitarists who don't, there are other avenues of expression that doesn't require that kind of mind-numbing speed and sheer technical facility and dexterity: Jeff Beck, for instance.

Tchaicovsky decided to become a composer at 21. Wagner decided music was his future when he was 15. So early-age training is not required to become a great composer or a musician, but Wagner was no Liszt when it came to playing the piano. I see plenty of musicians and some just have and have had the natural facility for speed without really working at it too hard. I have a friend who I've known since we were teenagers and who has world-class chops and can really nail anything by the likes of Yngwie, Satch, Vai, etc. He said the most he practiced in a day was perhaps 3 hours during his early teens. He said he reached the blurring Yngwie-type of speed and clarity in 3 years - around when he was 16. Some people just get there much, much faster than others and that's what I was trying to say.

But if one doesn't have that kind of chops, why should anyone be discouraged by it unless that kind of speed is necessary in one's playing? I do think people need to know their limitations and work within those confines. Everyone has limitations. I don't think Guthrie has any illusions about being able to play like Paco DeLucia on a gut-string flamenco guitar or being able to play like Eliot Fisk on a nylon-string classical or like Metheny or George Benson on an archtop or even like Jeff Beck or Jimi on a Strat or Brent Mason on a Tele. It's about finding what he is good at and what he loves to play.

I can never understand why some people get discouraged and depressed when they see a player like Guthrie. Instead of being inspired, they take a negative view - "Oh, it's just technique. He has no feel. The music doesn't move me. I'm into real songs." You can imagine how often I hear those kinds of lines when I try to introduce Guthrie to people I see at the shop. Some people who acknowledge him as a great talent and live only minutes away from here refused to come see him play during NAMM week. I'm just thinking, "Geez, here he is for 4 nights, you live within half-an-hour from here, and you don't want to pay lousy $20 to see this guy play for 2 hours?" Even that shredder friend I mentioned above refused to come see him play. But that's just how some people are, I guess. It's like they want to be able to do what he can do but can't, so they don't want someone showing them they are not capable and be humbled. Strange...

I'm sure Guthrie will make it back to the forum one of these days... He just doesn't seem like a forum type of a guy. Now he's still on the Asia tour all over Europe through end of March and then he'll be back in Southern Cal for some recording sessions in April, so I suspect that it'll be a while before we see him in here again, but he has been telling me that he will get back in here and start contributing again, so I suspect that he'll eventually get to it. He just has too many pressing musical endeavors going on at the moment.

If Guthrie had to pick one favorite player at the moment, I do think it'd be Scott Henderson. Just the way his eyes light up and his whole mood changes when his name is mentioned and how often he likes to talk about what he's doing tells me that Scott is, at least, one of his favorite 3 or 4 on his list. And Scott is the only player I've heard Guthrie mention as "Awesome..." to date although I've seen him give such facial expressions towards the likes of Paco DeLucia, Pat Metheny, John McLaughlin, Scotty Anderson, Brent Mason, Greg Howe... And he still loves Jimi... I think he's more interested in getting the vibe from these players than really learning what they're doing and being influenced directly. And he is always seeking out something different, something hip, something outside in a cool way, etc.
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Last edited by alexkhan on Fri Feb 25, 2005 5:08 am; edited 1 time in total
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Carlo



Joined: 13 Sep 2004
Posts: 408

PostPosted: Fri Feb 25, 2005 5:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

alexkhan wrote:
Some people who acknowledge him as a great talent and live only minutes away from here refused to come see him play during NAMM week. I'm just thinking, "Geez, here he is for 4 nights, you live within half-an-hour from here, and you don't want to pay lousy $20 to see this guy play for 2 hours?" Even that shredder friend I mentioned above refused to come see him play. But that's just how some people are, I guess.




that just angers me....it's just not fair Evil or Very Mad
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