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Zappa Stuff
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alexkhan



Joined: 10 Sep 2004
Posts: 2783
Location: Chino, CA

PostPosted: Sat Oct 02, 2004 2:44 am    Post subject: Zappa Stuff Reply with quote

I need to absorb more of this late genius. I've always been daunted by his vast catalog and have some stuff from different eras: "Uncle Meat" from the Mothers of Invention days, "Hot Rats", "Joe Garage Act", and "Shut Up and Play Y'er Guitar", but what else are essential Zappa recordings that I should add to my collection? Guthrie, your list of Zappa favorites would obviously be a great start. Wink Input from other members here who are very familiar with Zappa's humungous body of works would be most welcome as well.
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Donnie B.



Joined: 13 Sep 2004
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Location: Chula Vista, CA

PostPosted: Sat Oct 02, 2004 3:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ed, RUN right out and pick up "Zoot Allures" which contains the classic "Black Napkins" which is my favorite all time Zappa guitar track.


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alexkhan



Joined: 10 Sep 2004
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 12:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the tip, Donnie. I'll be certain to pick one up. Anyone else?
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Alun



Joined: 19 Sep 2004
Posts: 125
Location: Over Here

PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 7:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would also suggest getting "One Size Fits All" which contains another classic guitar solo on "Inca Roads" which is also a fantastic song ( several of the "Shut Up..." tracks are from live recordings of "Inca Roads").

Also- "The Best Band You Never Heard In Your Life" which also features the amazing Mike Keneally ( and the entire brass ection playing the Jimmy Page solo from "Stairway To Heaven" Very Happy ).

"Meets TheMothers Of Prevention" which features one of my all time favourite guitar riffs on "What's New In Baltimore?"

"Watermelon In Easter Hay" on "Joe's Garage Part 3" is also a classic solo.

Far too many to choose from......

Alun
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adrianclark



Joined: 22 Sep 2004
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 11:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Always difficult to choose good starting points for a newcomer, but this is what I posted in response to a similar thread on Intermusic...

"For maximum ease of listening (for a rock fan) along with snorting guitar playing and lots of tight virtuoso ensemble playing, get One Size Fits All, Apostrophe and Overnite Sensation, in that order. The third of those (IMO) is the least interesting, one of the albums that give people (mostly fundamentalist preachers) the idea that Zappa is all about mucky lyrics. He certainly did like to laugh at the weird sexual desperation he saw around him, but that only covers a small minority of his output. On a similar tack, I'd recommend checking out You Are What You Is... it's from the early 80s, so the cynical bitterness sometimes threatens to dominate, and some of the songs aren't as strong as others, but the whole format (2 "suites" with the songs all running together, with related storylines) is cool.

If you like your rock a bit more daring and have a sense of humour, get Studio Tan. I often think this may be my single favourite Zappa album... you get a cheesy pop song, a lush jazzy piece, a complex orchestrated piece and a 20-minute musical comedy with some of the most fantastic playing I've ever heard. If you can handle this sort of thing, it's time to check out the original Mothers of Invention line-up... Freak Out, Absolutely Free and We're Only in it for the Money. I really love Uncle Meat but it's better left until you're a bit more acclimatised.

For jazzy instrumental stuff with more guitar, listen to Hot Rats, Waka/Jawaka or maybe The Grand Wazoo. The latter two are among my favourite jazz albums ever, but have that unmistakeable Zappa sound. For his orchestral work, the compilation Strictly Genteel seems a little hard to find, but is a good starting point.

For an accurate impression of just how good some of FZ's touring bands were, check out You Can't Do That on Stage Anymore - Vol 2 (a full gig by the virtuoso 73/74 band) and The Best Band You Never Heard in your Life (the 1988 band with Mike Keneally). Steve Vai fans should check out YCDTOSA - Vol 5... disc 2 is all live material from 1981 (although Vai didn't play solos). "



Adrian
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bill®



Joined: 11 Sep 2004
Posts: 72

PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 11:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For some nice easy listening that let's you know what Zappa was REALLY all about, pick up 'The Yellow Shark'.
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jordan



Joined: 28 Sep 2004
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 8:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I bought the "Does Humour Belong In Music" DVD this weekend, which is a live show from NYC in 1984.....it has to be the funniest thing I've ever seen.

I was actually spitting out drink at one point, due to the lyrics and stage charisma of FZ and his band.

Quite how someone could sing a song called "He's So Gay" only 20 years ago is beyond me!

Not alot of guitar playing on there, but what there is is typical Zappa, almost conversation-like lead playing. A truly eccentric genius. I find the most remarkable thing is the tightness of the band, considering the ridiculous arrangements and constantly changing time signatures.
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frankus



Joined: 13 Sep 2004
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Location: Chelmsford/Arachnipus

PostPosted: Tue Dec 28, 2004 5:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How on earth did I miss a thread on Zappa? And worse still Adrian Clark got there first, so all I can say is: what he said.

Reading another Zappa biog at present... the guy was incredibly perceptive both politically and musically. The mothers played at the Grammy awards in the 60s which of course Zappa used to throw it right back at them "this is the one day of the year, you people have to listen to the shit you produce" Very Happy

Apostrophe and Over night Sensation are tops and were one album at one stage.
I really like Treacherous Cretins from Shut Up and Play your Guitar (3 guitar based CDs) noone mentioned that yet.
And Thing Fish for sheer operatic wit..

I find it easier to point to tracks than albums cos these can go from pure comedy to standard lewd blues at the drop of a hat and off into classical Stravinsky or Rimsky Korsakov or Mozart before getting into social commentary and Edgard Varesé.

I'd like to hear what Guthrie's list contains..
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bill®



Joined: 11 Sep 2004
Posts: 72

PostPosted: Wed Dec 29, 2004 1:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What you REALLY should get is the Roxy & Elsewhere CD. This thing is flooping awesome!! It's one of the most fun-inclined Zappa albums.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B0000009SK/qid=1104283930/sr=2-1/ref=pd_ka_b_2_1/102-8338153-0272106

I'm sure Guthrie would endorse it, speaking of whom I wonder how his album's going? I want him to answer my question. Smile
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dkaplowitz



Joined: 19 Mar 2005
Posts: 73
Location: Narberth, PA

PostPosted: Sun Mar 20, 2005 3:34 pm    Post subject: Re: Zappa Stuff Reply with quote

alexkhan wrote:
I need to absorb more of this late genius. I've always been daunted by his vast catalog... ...but what else are essential Zappa recordings that I should add to my collection? ...Input from other members here who are very familiar with Zappa's humungous body of works would be most welcome as well.

At last a thread I can identify with! Ed, how has your perusal into Frank's catalog been going since you started this thread? I'd be curious to hear your impressions so far of your expanded FZ listening.

It'd help if you posted what you like most about the recordings already in your possession. I know Zappa's first 70 or so albums pretty well and I like them all for differing reasons, and of course some a lot more than others. I don't know a lot of the stuff that's been released posthumously by the ZFT that well ---though I know for sure FZ OZ is tremendous! I'm really impressed with that one.

My favorite Zappa time period is the 70s to early 80s. I like the "One Size Fits All" band a lot. They were also on the "Roxy And Elsewhere" recording (I second that recommendation --if you don't like that album, then FZ might not be for you. I can't recommend it highly enough). You Can't Do That on Stage Vol II is another great set of live performances from this band.

Then there's the Zappa In New York album --another tremendous release. Great band, amazing complex polyrhythmic arrangements ("approximate", the first appearance of "The Black Page", "The Purple Lagoon" ---featuring blistering solos over odd meters by the Brecker Brothers). This is another sine qua non recording.

After that was the stuff that FZ had the dispute with Warner over (they released it all with ugly album covers against Frank's wishes --and I think the mixes weren't done yet either). Studio Tan, Sleep Dirt, Orchestral Favorites. These were all released by Frank much later in a 3CD box called "Lather". This one really highlights Franks complex compositions with a mix of orchestral sounding arrangements (heavier in "Orchestral Leftovers") and some of the best larger band compositions recorded. "Gregary Peccary" is an absolute must. RDNZL is another. If you don't want to shell out for Lather or all three recordings separately, do get Studio Tan.

Then there's the early 80s stuff that I love like Sheik Yerbouti -- possibly my favorite b/c this was one of the first ones I ever really "got". "You Are What You Is" (features Steve Vai on "stunt guitar"), "Ship Arriving Too Late..." "Them or Us".

Okay...I've typed enough. I missed tons of stuff, but I was just pointing out my personal favorites. I like Frank with a tight small-ish band of great musicians best. I love his orchestral stuff too but give me the bands with either Chester Thompson, Terry Bozzio, Vinny, or Chad on drums any day.

I have some of Frank's sheet music and it's some of the most insane rhythmic music you'll ever encounter. If you think you know rhythms, see if you can get your mind around this measure from "The Black Page":


It took me a ton of time (and asking around) to even figure out how to understand the rhythm. I still can't play it. (In fact I still struggle with whole note triplets ---I can only play them really slowly).

Anyway, I'd love to hear your thoughts on the recordings you've tried based on people's recommendations in this thread.

Cheers,

Dave
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Mirth



Joined: 25 Jan 2005
Posts: 160
Location: USA

PostPosted: Sun Mar 20, 2005 10:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

for my zappa friends and I we would always suggest this one, with out a doubt,


"Live at the Roxy and Elsewhere"

Excellent disc.


She's just like a penguin in Bondage, BOOIINNNG!!! Oh yea



Tim
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frankus



Joined: 13 Sep 2004
Posts: 1100
Location: Chelmsford/Arachnipus

PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2005 9:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

frankus wrote:
How on earth did I miss a thread on Zappa? And worse still Adrian Clark got there first, so all I can say is: what he said.


I forgot all about this thread and reading down it I experienced the same "oh arse, now I can't profess to know anything about Zappa" and "cool, I didn't know Adrian was on here" ambivilence I'd have experienced last time. Laughing

What I will say is that DoctorJazz used to lend Zappa tapes to a guy called Simon Riley, who used to play them to Guy Wilson who used to buy Zappa CDs and play them to me Wink (around 1989) .. so my interest in Zappa can be traced back to DoctorJazz Smile .. cheers Simon Cool
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alexkhan



Joined: 10 Sep 2004
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Location: Chino, CA

PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2005 8:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have some of the classic obvious stuff like Uncle Meat, We're Only In It..., Hot Rats, and Shut Up N' Play Yer Guitar and a few others buried in my massive collection somewhere. Haven't had the time to really follow through on getting more stuff, but I will soon. Thanks for all the input, guys!
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James W



Joined: 22 Oct 2004
Posts: 191

PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 11:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lather is pretty great.


... Love aje msXXXXXX
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kikkan



Joined: 12 Jan 2005
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Tue May 03, 2005 4:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hi guys!
im also trying to get "into" zappa at the moment. got the hot rats, wazoo stuff and the dvd-does humor belong in music(frankly, i diddt enjoy it that much, maby because i was looking after guitar and "advanced" zappa, but it was quite funny Wink)

where can i find the best recording of "the black page"? and more of the rythmic advanced stuff.

thanx, chris
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